Quayle: First of all, if they're submegaton, that means they're in the kiloton range. I think you said two megatons. I think you mean two kilotons?

Martin: The document I was reading from says two megatons.

Quayle: Then forgive me, I know nothing of that. You see, you can't have a sub-megaton weapon. Isn't that what they're talking about?

Martin: The exact phraseology here is: "softball-sized, two-megaton fusion bombs, so-called s-megaton micro-nuclear warheads".

Quayle: What that would be would be a derivation of the Mirv warhead technology, if it's in the megaton realm. Remember, Hiroshima was 14-18 kilotons. And there are a thousand kilotons to a megaton. That's why I'm stammering over your question. It's almost saying two diametrically opposed statements. If something is sub-megaton, it's less than a megaton; so it's in the kiloton range. If it is a two-megaton bomb, it would not be sub. Do you follow me?

Martin: Yes.

Quayle: It would be a two-megaton, softball-sized nuclear weapon.

Martin: So, s-megaton means "sub"?

Quayle: Yes.

Martin: Are you familiar with softball-fusion bombs?

Quayle: Yes. But everything that I know related to that is the Red Mercury style.

Martin: Are those so-called "dirty bombs"?

Quayle: No, they're not. Those are fissile weapons, ok? Fission takes place. A "dirty" weapon is conventional explosives, wrapped with radioactive materials like uranium, plutonium.

Martin: I see.

Quayle: When we're talking about Red Mercury, we're talking about actual nuclear—which means they have the process of fission taking place. A fusion bomb, by the way, is another way of saying thermonuclear, and that's usually reserved for hydrogen bombs. Does that make sense?

Martin: Yes, it does. I'm glad I asked you about that, because I was confused about it.

Quayle: And I'm confused, because I've never seen s-megaton. That's usually always referring to sub-megaton.

Let me share this with you. But put this down as rumor. What's rumor "out there" is that under Bill Clinton's administration—according to a nuclear physicist who is well aware of the defense industry—Clinton gave the Chinese, or actually saw to the transfer to the Chinese, what would be called our micro-miniaturized warheads, ok? That's the most TOP-SECRET thing we have, in our nuclear arsenal. So, IF it is in their possession, IF it is a two-megaton fusiontype weapon, then that IS state-of-the-art. The only place that Saddam Hussein could get that would be from the Chinese.

In a Mirv warhead, we went to smaller and smaller missiles, but more powerful warheads. The two-megaton warheads— if you've got, say, five of those sitting in the nosecone of an ICBM or a Tomahawk or whatever delivery system you're using—those would all be considered, if you will, micro-miniature warheads.

Martin: Let me read this to you. The headline is "The Balance Of Terror And The Red Mercury Nightmare", dated March 26, 2002, by J. R. Nyquist.

Quayle: I know Jeff Nyquist, he does his homework.

Martin: The second paragraph reads, quoting:

What the CIA director could not say, and perhaps what makes President George W. Bush so desperately eager to wipe out the regime of Saddam Hussein, is that Russia may have given Red Mercury fusion technology to Saddam. According to one of my sources, Iraq possesses "s-megaton" micro-nuclear warheads. These are softball-sized, two megaton fusion bombs triggered by an irradiated and compressed compound of mercury antimony oxide. This device doubles the nuclear yield with a hundred-fold reduction of weight. Using heavy hydrogen instead of uranium or plutonium to fuel its explosive reaction, this hand-held nuclear weapon cannot be detected by U.S. sensors. End quoting.

Quayle: That is true, they cannot be detected.

Martin: So, is that an accurate paragraph?

Quayle: The only thing I would question is the fusion part of it, ok? Because, every time, and my source is Sam Cohen on this, every time we talked, it was never a thermonuclear reaction— that is, fusion is a hydrogen-type thing. If we're talking about deuterium, that's what heavy hydrogen is, then that makes me think it IS a fusion weapon. I'm not trying to play games, I'm just trying to understand the context of this. The only way Saddam could have gotten that is from the Chinese. I don't think the Russians would give it to him; the Chinese would.

To be safe, I should just say that Saddam could only get this from either the Russians or the Chinese.

You're talking about state-of-the-art nuclear weapons development; and talking about, still, our government's position, to this day, regarding Red Mercury, is that it doesn't exist. But I can tell you this: this whole change in the U.S. defense posture, and with us using our nuclear weapons to go after rogue states, is based on the premise that Red Mercury DOES exist. Does that help?

Martin: It helps a great deal.

Quayle: And let me say this: probably the guy who invented the neutron bomb—because the difference between a neutron bomb is that it kills by a high dosage of neutrons, where it doesn't blow-up, and produce fallout; it produces massive amounts of radiation that kills all living things, but doesn't touch the buildings and all that stuff.

What you're talking about is what I said about the Clinton years. The most top-secret, high-powered, microminiature warheads that we designed, were given to the Chinese.

Now, the Russians probably stole them from us before the Chinese. But I would say, knowing where Saddam's weapons development program is coming from, I'd guess the Chinese got them to him. But that's just speculation on my part.

Let me just add—and this isn't because this is a pet thing of mine—YOU'RE ONTO THE BIGGEST STORY

THERE IS!

Martin: Going on 7 years ago, I did a story that I called Depopulation Of A Planet [available online if you search under "depopulation"]. This was a multi-part, extensive series, on depopulation of the planet, using all of the research I could find, which was substantial. Also in the mid-'9Os, I did a series on the Gulf War Syndrome, as it was happening, also extensive. And I've been talking to Len for years, so it isn't like I'm just stumbling across this. But in this story, I'd like to frame it so that our readers can put it into some kind of context that won't completely freak them out.

Quayle: What you're doing in your investigative journalist role is, you're the "puzzle master". You've got an understanding the puzzle exists. I've given you pieces. Gordon's given you pieces. Len's given you pieces. I think you're going to be shocked, even with as much as you know, when you've tied together all the loose ends. I've tied it together in my mind. But what's going to be wonderful about what you're doing, you're going to be puking it out there for the people. And this story that you're writing, in my opinion, is the biggest story of history. When I say that, I mean of contemporary history.

And you're getting stuff from me that I don't think you could get from anybody else. And I get stuff from people that I couldn't get from anybody else. But you have the skill and ability, as a writer, to put it all together. And that's why I want to just tell you: I will whole-heartedly, and just unreservedly, co-operate with you.

Martin: Great.

Quayle: Now, to answer your question, specifically. I think we're going to have a simultaneous event of a biological release and multiple nukes, released in 34 cities.

Martin: Does the phrase "consequence assessment" come in here?

Quayle: Yes. Consequence assessment or CATS—consequence assessment tool set—is what the military uses to predict the outcome of chemical, biological, or nuclear weapons detonations, within a given area. It factors in time of day, barometric pressure, humidity, clear day, cloudy day, all of the known effects.

Something no one talks about is, I've got to get this in: EMP or electromagnetic pulse. You can kiss communications goodbye, including radio and TV and the Internet, if these guys are detonating some of the preplaced strategic nuclear weapons. It was always thought that just one 25-megaton air-burst over Omaha would wipe it all out.

At the least-worse-case scenario, we're dealing with regional failure of all communications, because most civic communications, outside of FEMA, are not hardened for EMP.

So, that's a consequence that no one— especially the talking moron-heads on mainstream TV—has even factored-in. If a nuclear weapon is detonated' even a tactical nuclear weapon, there's a lot of electromagnetic pulse generated.

Martin: If there are several nuclear bombs exploded at once, and a biological release, essentially society as we know it comes to a grinding halt.

Quayle: Exactly.

Martin: So, we're back to a tribal society.

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